Oatmeal, McGuire, and Entitlement
I like The Oatmeal, and I’ve seen a lot of people pointing to this comic, often with a comment like, “This is why people pirate!”
I see two things in this comic. The first is an excellent point: people want to be able to buy and download things when they come out. More and more people watch and read things online, and it’s incredibly frustrating when that option isn’t available. In this example, I think HBO is probably making a mistake by not selling Game of Thrones to people who want to watch it.
The second thing in this comic, however, feels like pure entitlement. HBO has made a business decision to only offer the show for download to HBO subscribers. I think that’s a bad business decision, but does the fact that the show is not available RIGHT THIS SECOND mean people have the right to say, “Oh well, I tried. Time to go swipe it off a torrent site!”
My next book is going to be released as a hardcover, which means it will cost about $25. I totally understand that not everyone will want to pay $25 for a book, and I’m happy that a year later, you should be able to buy it for $8 as a paperback. But if you want a copy of that book for $8, you have to wait. You don’t get to say, “I want it now!” and just swipe it off a bookstore shelf.
DRM is annoying. Businesses that don’t make their products available to users who want to buy them is frustrating as hell. But the entitlement thing is a problem too.
Case in point: Seanan McGuire’s latest book went on sale early at Amazon … in print format. The e-book edition won’t be available until the on-sale date. As a result, readers and so-called fans have been heaping abuse on her because … well, because they might have to wait a whole two weeks to buy the e-book:
People who have to wait for their electronic books are not being denied anything; they’re doing what was supposed to happen in the first place. This has not stopped the exciting emails from rolling in. They mostly stopped after the first day, but on that first day, I was called…
…a bitch.
…a whore.
…a cunt.
…stupid.
…greedy.
…ungrateful.
…narcissistic.
Because that sense of entitlement, the idea that I WANT IT RIGHT NOW!!!, is so powerful that these people felt justified in attacking and threatening the author, then running out to pirate all of her books. The author who, incidentally, has no control over this situation!
Naturally, since Seanan is female, the abuse is even harsher and significantly sexualized. Because women, like books and TV shows, are possessions, right? And we’re entitled to say or do whatever we like to them.
What the f*** is wrong with people?
I get being frustrated when you really want to watch/read something and you can’t. It frustrates the hell out of me when publishers limit availability or cripple a file’s usability. And I know perfectly well that people will choose to pirate files when they can’t easily buy them.
But for God’s sake, get a spine and own that choice. Don’t pretend the evil publisher made you do it. Take responsibility for the fact that you couldn’t bother to wait two weeks for Seanan’s book to be available legally, or that you didn’t want to subscribe to HBO and didn’t want to wait for them to make the show available through other outlets.
I don’t really get worked up about piracy these days. I have more important (to me) things to care about. And I get that it’s a more complicated issue than a lot of people want to admit.
But the entitlement thing pisses me off, especially when that attitude leads to such vicious attacks on my friends.
Alice K.
February 23, 2012 @ 4:08 pm
You’re a good man, Mr. Hines. The situation is bad enough in the first place, but the conclusions people are jumping to, and the attitudes, are just appalling. I am SO TIRED of people saying stuff like, “It’s the internet. What did you expect?” as if we can’t do better.
Mels
February 23, 2012 @ 4:24 pm
first, I’m running on 8 hours sleep for the past 48 hours so if this makes no sense, I’m sorry and please ignore me.
re the oatmeal and that strip in particular: I am one of the people who is similarly frustrated by such situations but doesn’t pirate (I have, once or twice, been tempted enough to do so and was thwarted by a combination of laziness and firewall issues, but generally I shrug and say oh well) but then I usually end up forgetting about keeping up with the show, which is just a long winded way of saying “here’s another thing wrong with that business model.” However, your analogy is not quite accurate as far as internet copyright infringements go; it’s more akin to going to the library/bookstore and photocopying the book and leaving the original than taking it off the shelf. (not endorsing it, because it’s still a shit thing to do, just clarifying for the sake of strengthening the argument)
and re: abusing people because they aren’t serving your every whim/believe something different, or whatever, I agree with Alice that it is faboo you are speaking up. I have actually gotten scolded by friends for not ignoring douchebags being douchebags, not because they endorse the douchebaggery, but because they feel acknowledging it will in effect “feed the trolls.” I say if you want to make a change in the world, you gotta acknowledge what you want to change, and I salute you for doing so.
Jim C. Hines
February 23, 2012 @ 4:27 pm
Yeah, I know the bookstore analogy wasn’t entirely perfect … but it’s what I had in my anger-fueled typing. Angry post means it’s not quite as polished as what I usually put up here.
One of my favorite quotes is from Edmund Burke, “All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing.”
I’d switch good men to good people, but otherwise, yes. Standing by, keeping silent … I think if more people were willing to step up and speak out, it would make a tremendous difference in the world.
BethanytheMartian
February 23, 2012 @ 4:38 pm
I follow several entertainers who make videos and put them on the internet- they make money off the add sales. Recently, sales have been down, so many reviewers added a commercial in the middle of mostly longer videos (30-40 minutes or so).
You would certainly believe the hate and discontent this has stirred up in the community. You would think that the video-makers had done something actually reprehensible. It just irritates. Being on the internet does not mean that anything goes. It doesn’t mean that a user has the right to every bit of entertainment available. Furthermore, being denied that entertainment for a few seconds/minutes/days/years/decades is NOT some kind of fascism. It’s just how things go, sometimes.
Anne Lyle
February 23, 2012 @ 4:39 pm
That’s just appalling. Some people have all the emotional maturity of a two-year-old – and the distancing effect of the internet allows them to behaviour in ways they would never do in person. Or maybe they would. I just hope I never meet one.
Re the timing, I’ve noticed Amazon are doing this a lot – shipping physical books as soon as they arrive in the warehouse, but not releasing the Kindle edition until the official publication date. Here in the UK, you can’t even pre-order the Kindle edition, whereas you can in the US. WTF, Amazon??
My own book comes out in a few weeks – if I start getting this kind of crap, I shall be blocking certain email accounts.
Stephen Blackmoore
February 23, 2012 @ 4:42 pm
As always sir, spot on and well spoken. And far less vitriolic than I could hope to be.
Kathryn
February 23, 2012 @ 5:07 pm
You make good points, Jim, but I think we can take this one step further.
What can the publishers, distributors and so on do in order to mitigate this? With the rise in e-distribution, internet shopping and so forth, publishers and so on have been very slow to change. One would argue that it’s up to the publishers to try and get things moving as fast as possible. After all, it would mean more sales, no?
With Game of Thrones, HBO have brought it upon themselves, one could argue. I see the logic in that argument. They’ve waited about a year since the show first broadcast to release it on DVD. Hasbro, however, release My Little Pony: Friendship is Magic episodes on iTunes around the same time as their broadcast date. The BBC released Sherlock within about two months of the series ending, and the same goes for Doctor Who – in fact, I think the non-boxset releases come out as the show is on the air, but I could be wrong on that.
And with the HC/MMPB thing – some publishers release HC and TPB concurrently, or rarely HC/MMPB. That is a good compromise, as it allows the consumer to decide. The idea of waiting a year for a MMPB just feels archaic now, unnecessary even. I like L.E. Modesitt, Jr.’s Imager books, but Tor US have made it hard for me. Scholar released last year (#4, #1 in a new trilogy) in HB and Princeps (#5/#2) comes out in a few months. The MMPB of Scholar isn’t out until October! So I have to wait until October to get the MMPB, whereas those who buy the HCs will be ahead of me. Luckily people don’t seem to discuss Modesitt much in communities I visit, so I’m free from spoilers, but for other books, it’s not so easy to avoid.
I certainly don’t feel entitled to a MMPB copy of Scholar now, but I feel frustrated that Tor US release Modesitt MMPBs at seemingly random intervals. On top of that, their support of Kindle editions in the UK is bizarre. I can buy Modesitt eBooks for very reasonable prices, but I can’t buy Peter Orullian’s debut.
I wish, wish, wish that the turnarounds were quicker. I can wait – I am waiting, even – but it doesn’t mean I have to like it. I certainly don’t have any right to pirate or steal anything, though.
Stephen A. Watkins
February 23, 2012 @ 5:36 pm
I agree with you 99% of the way…
Except the part where we talk about “choosing not to subscribe to HBO”. The problem, there, is that the choice is not so easily financially differentiable. Some a-hole who can’t wait 2 weeks for a book to come out is one thing. You just wait 2 weeks and BAM, problem solved. Not exactly a serious inconvenience, really. So the people who are using that to justify pirating Seanan’s books and call her nasty names… well… “my momma always said ‘a-hole is as a-hole does'”. So I’m totally with you there.
But that’s not apples-to-apples with the “Game of Thrones” situation. To get HBO you have to subscribe to cable or satellite TV – itself not an inexpensive option – and pay a hefty fee to subsidize a lot of stuff you probably won’t watch… we’re talking something like a minimum of $60 a month, or nearly $1000 a year, and that’s just for expanded basic . And then you pay a little extra on top to get a premium channel like HBO. For someone who just wants to watch “Game of Thrones”… that’s a damned expensive TV show.
So you can shell out a grand for a single TV show… or you can wait until it’s available on one of those other services, likely a year or more, and pay something a little more reasonable, a temporal inconvenience that is a wholly different order of magnitude from waiting a few weeks, or even a few months.
Myself, I don’t have cable – it’s expensive and there are cheaper and better options for my entertainment dollar. That does mean I don’t get to watch HBO shows, of course. And I’m okay with the fact that I won’t be catching up on shows like “Game of Thrones” for… what… a year or more at a minimum before it’s available on Netflix. And I agree that it’s a nasty sense of entitlement that thinks I should be able to watch it now and damn the rules. I’m not condoning piracy by any means; what’s wrong is wrong.
But at the same time, equating a nasty a-hole who is using nasty language and pirating an author’s entire library of completed works for having had to wait a couple weeks with the somewhat too-entitled-feeling schlub who can’t stomach ponying up a cool grand just to watch a cool new TV show… well… the two don’t quite equate. One is an a-hole. The other is someone who’s been jerked around by entrenched business practices that are designed to protect an outmoded content delivery ecosystem, and has been frustrated at every turn to try to legally acquire a program at a reasonable price. The first had legal options that were not significantly burdensome to pursue (purchasing the hardcover or waiting a mere couple weeks for the e-book). The second did have legal options… but they were substantially more burdensome, in terms of cost or time. What he did was still wrong, but there are ameliorating factors.
Puddin
February 23, 2012 @ 5:40 pm
I agree 100% with what you wrote here. Many of my coworkers don’t bat an eye at getting a pirated copy of book or copying music from someone else and then roll their eyes when I express disapproval.
You know, because all authors and musicians are “rich”
I agree it is frustrating when you want some content via whatever method you prefer to get your content. I myself hate having to subscribe to HBO for AGoT. But frustration doesn’t give anyone the right to take what they want, and I wish more people would see that just because something’s digital doesn’t mean it should be free or available on their terms.
Chrysoula
February 23, 2012 @ 5:43 pm
What makes the GoT thing so much more infuriating is the inability to even borrow it. At least with hardcover books there are legitimate methods to acquire it before a cheaper version is available. (ok, maybe not ebook versions).
It’s interesting because one thing I wanted from GoT viewing was some of the social experience of watching it. Because I couldn’t have that without an expensive cable package, my interest in watching it has gone way down. Content these days isn’t just consumed for the content itself anymore.
But yes. We all know there are problems with HBOs delivery model. I do somehow feel like it’s different getting frustrated with HBO vs getting frustrated with Seanan McGuire, lthough I can’t put my finger on it. Maybe because the equivalent to Seanan in this case is GRRM? Would angry email to Amazon and the publisher be more appropriate? Or is it still demonstrating a sense of entitlement? Or is the entitlement coming in when one chooses to pirate rather than just be angry?
Mikaela
February 23, 2012 @ 5:53 pm
There is a lot of things I like about e-books. There is also a lot of things that annoys me. Geo-restrictions, formatting, and yes, windowing. The 2 weeks delay is one example of windowing. All three things are a part of the publishing business. Is it frustrating? Oh yes. Do I grumble? Sure. But I grumble at home. Or sometimes at my blog. But, But, I never, ever blame the author. Mainly since the author cannot affect the things that annoys me. If I blame someone, I blame the publisher.
Oh, and if I cannot wait? I get the paper book. ( Sometimes I get the paperback twice, since I pre-ordered it and then forgot about it. But that is another story)
Jim C. Hines
February 23, 2012 @ 5:59 pm
Oh, I agree that the two situations aren’t 100% parallel, definitely. And I admit I don’t know everything behind the Games of Throne situation … though I’ve been told, ironically, that GoT *will* be available as of March 6. The same day as Seanan’s book. (I’m running around tonight trying to herd kids to get ready for my daughter’s recital, so I might be frazzling some of the details.)
The Oatmeal example shows me someone that I’d basically say, “Meh.” I do think there’s entitlement there, but it falls under the “I’m not going to lose sleep over this” category.
When entitlement transforms into abuse, on the other hand … then it’s stabbing time.
Jim C. Hines
February 23, 2012 @ 6:00 pm
As a greedy author, I totally support buying the book twice 🙂
Stephen A. Watkins
February 23, 2012 @ 6:01 pm
Yes, absolutely: abuse like that just isn’t conscionable, no matter how you slice it.
Jim C. Hines
February 23, 2012 @ 6:34 pm
FWIW, we’re starting to move toward technologies to let you lend and borrow e-books. Not there yet, but hopefully we’ll keep making progress on that front.
In Seanan’s case, an angry e-mail to the publisher wouldn’t help. She and I share a publisher, and while I can’t get into some of the details, I can pretty much guarantee DAW is pissed off about this situation too.
cedunkley
February 23, 2012 @ 7:04 pm
I’ve had GoT pre-ordered from Amazon for quite a while now. I don’t want to pay all the extra money just to have HBO to watch GoT so I wait. While I think HBO’s HBO Go business model makes little sense to me in today’s digital age I have to accept that is the way it goes. I don’t get how casually someone can steal a product just because they want it or just because its digital instead of physical.
And why anyone would blame the author when they have nothing to do with the publication schedule of the various format of their books is just mind boggling. Like an author is going to say: “No thank you, don’t publish my book in every possible available format just yet. You can take your time putting the various versions out at your whim, O Great Publisher!”
Congrats on the coming Hardcover. Pretty sweet. Is this a first for you? Alas, I’ve no hardcover space to purchase it. However, as the universe tends to balance things out, even though I already own all 4 Princess books in MMS I’ve got them lined up to repurchase as ebooks. I’ve gotten into the Lend the paperback; Read the ebook routine lately.
And as for the ugliness towards Seanan, as you pointed out, that speaks of a much larger deep-rooted issue in society. I don’t venture too often into the Urban Fantasy/Paranormal Romance subgenre but if for no other reason than to show some support – and hopefully discover another excellent writer – I’m going to wait patiently and buy Seasan’s ebook when it comes out.
Janice in GA
February 23, 2012 @ 7:14 pm
I currently have a couple of new e-book releases sitting on my wish lists because I’m poor and need to wait for them to drop down from their initial release price of something like $14.99 to something less than that. It’s pretty equivalent for me to waiting for the paperback version of a dead tree book to come out. I hate having to wait, but jeezopete, it’s certainly nothing I would yell at an author for. It’s not the author’s fault I’m frugal/poor. 🙂
The price I’m willing to buy something for is, for me, a good indicator of how much I want to read the book. New Terry Pratchett? Yeah, I’ll pay a premium to get that ASAP. And I’ll buy the audiobook from Audible too. Some other authors that I love? I can wait a bit.
I’ve been a little frustrated over the GoT availability too. No way I’m subscribing to HBO just to watch that show. We DO have cable, but I go days without even turning the TV on. The only series I’ve followed in ages was Downton Abbey. O.o If it weren’t for the sports and the weather channel for my husband, we’d probably be fine without it.
But when All the Cool Kids are talking about GoT and there’s no way to get it? Bad.
But even then I don’t torrent, cuz (in my world) that’s Worse.
Anne Lyle
February 23, 2012 @ 7:24 pm
I have cable, but I would have to switch to satellite to get HBO because Sky have an exclusive deal with them in the UK. Sorry, but no way. I’m not changing my entire TV, phone and internet setup over one TV show.
I “acquired” the first episode only, partly to see if it was as good as proclaimed, partly because I was about to go to a big SFF convention where I thought it might be talked about. Now I’m patiently waiting for the Blu-Ray boxed set, so I feel no guilt about it – HBO still get their money. Eventually.
This Is NOT Okay « The End Of Nowhere
February 23, 2012 @ 7:31 pm
[…] decision that was not theirs, but to also relegate them to a perceived negative sexual status.Why? Jim C. Hines and Marie Brennan have both chimed in on how inappropriate this […]
Jim C. Hines
February 23, 2012 @ 8:21 pm
This is indeed my first hardcover with DAW, thank you! I’m excited. And nervous.
I totally get that a lot of people aren’t going to buy the book in hardcover. Heck, I generally wait for the paperback to come out too. Though hopefully more libraries will pick it up, which should give folks the opportunity to check it out.
And thank you, re: the princess books!
I heard Seanan read the first chapter of her book a few months back, and it was a lot of fun. I’m looking forward to reading this one!
Victoria
February 23, 2012 @ 9:24 pm
It wasn’t really all that long ago that we had to wait for movies to be re-released in the theater to see them again. I remember as a kid, anticipating Thanksgiving weekend especially, because it was the one time a year when The Wizard of Oz was televised. The fact that people can’t wait two whole weeks for something boggles my brain. Two whole weeks! The horror!
And while I wait for Game of Thrones to finally show up on Netflix, there’s lots of other ways to waste, er, occupy my time.
Morghan
February 23, 2012 @ 9:27 pm
You mention DRM. I can see how people are ticked about piracy, but DRM is a far greater evil. People who are going to distribute content illegally have no trouble cracking DRM.
I’ve actually torrented a game and an album before because of broken DRM that prevents me from using my legally purchased copy of the item. The thing I think rights holders should be concerned about with that is if someone is forced to resort to piracy because a legitimate purchase doesn’t work will find out just how easy it is to get ALL of their stuff for free and I can’t help but think many of them will stop buying things once they learn that stealing offers a superior product to purchasing.
Not everyone is so worried about piracy that they break their products, Baen, for example is where I would buy everything if I hadn’t already purchased everything they offer in electronic format that interests me.
Vanades
February 23, 2012 @ 9:34 pm
I recently talked to a younger friend about pre-internet times. Ordering an English book in a German bookstore could take between 10 days and 6 months. Yes, I once had to wait 6 months for a copy of E.M. Forster’s Maurice to find it’s way from the UK to my German bookstore. That was in the late 80s. Even ordering German books could take several days to several weeks. So I know all about patience. Even today with US- or UK-TV shows, they are geo-locked so I either have to wait for the DVD to come out and buy that one blind or wait if and when a German dubbing (!!!!!) will be available. And German dubbing usually means questionable translation, different voices and different interpretations of the characters. And then you sometimes have the problem that Gary Oldman, Daniel Craig and Jeff Goldblum have the same voice or different voices in different films.
Anyway, I’m digressing. I have learned patience. And there’s always something else available that I can read or watch instead. I don’t HAVE to have something immediately. Finances are tight so I have to wait for the paperback even though I would love to read the newest Tanya Huff right now. I can wait.
As for the name-calling. People, that’s the writer you’re harassing. A writer who’s already stressed enough about this screw-up and with the new book being released. She’s the one who wrote the book you seem to be unable to life without. Now imagine she takes your words to heart and stops writing? She wouldn’t be the first one to throw in the towel.
I also can never understand why it always has to so sexually abusive the moment a woman is involved. Seriously what’s wrong with these people? Especially considering that it’s a writer they claim to like or love, or at least who’s books they love. Do you talk to someone you like that way?
D. Moonfire
February 23, 2012 @ 11:47 pm
It can be frustrating when things don’t move as fast as you want them to. I think we are getting so used to instant gratification, that waiting a year for a book to come out or six months for a DVD seems like an eternity when it is just… right… over there. Yeah, it isn’t legal, but it’s there. Just hard when everything else is out there, begging to be downloaded.
I love the Oatmeal, and I don’t disagree, but I think it is the problem with HBO not moving with the times, as it were, instead of an encouragement to pirate. Netflix streaming is much the same way, it is viewed as a huge money sink, but I’m willing to pay money to get videos. But, finding that nothing even remotely recent is kind of annoying. Plus, finding out that most of my DVD collection isn’t on there is just as annoying.
Most of the time, I want only one thing: format shifting. I want my DVD’s as video files because I have an 18 month old who is already destroying them and a wifetype who ruins them. Plus I drop them or crack them steadily over time due to accidents’. So, I want backups I can play and know the video won’t be removed on a whim or for money (e.g., Whitney Houston’s movies being pulled from Netflix because someone could make more money).
I’d say the same for books. I really wish there was some way to convert most of my books to ebooks legally. I’d be willing to pay for it (more so after packing them to move), but there isn’t. I want to give people money so I can shift the format to something that works… but I can’t. I wouldn’t care if getting said ebook required me to destroy the physical one. I just want it in a better format.
And DRM is annoying because a book can be read by anyone. It can’t be removed when you aren’t looking (for example, 1984 on the Kindle), it works in anyone’s hands, and basically it is accessible. I want the ebook the same way.
I also wish there was something like Kickstarter where you could say “I promise to buy the book if you make it DRM free”. I only bought music when it was stripped of DRM (Amazon MP3) and I only buy ebooks that are DRM free too (probably why I don’t have a Kindle).
And to tie it to the beginning. I know what I want, but I also know I don’t get it. So, I go without. I wanted your novels in DRM-free ebooks and I was willing to pay a premium, but I couldn’t find them. I tried for a couple days to find a version, which more than most people would give it. I did the same for all my favorite authors, but… I go without. I have hard copies of course, but I’m trying to reduce my Stuff in general (50 boxes of books breaks morale nicely).
Just have to wait for the world to catch up. 🙁 Until then, I spend my money on something else (but they will never know because I have no way of telling them).
As for the other note, there is never a reason to insult someone like that. Period.
Elizabeth Anne Ensley
February 24, 2012 @ 7:38 am
Early in the morning for me. I read that as “slobbering time”.
Jim C. Hines
February 24, 2012 @ 7:38 am
Isn’t that the Thing’s new battlecry in the Fantastic Four reboot?
Elizabeth Anne Ensley
February 24, 2012 @ 7:58 am
Channel 9, WWOR-TV, where I am. They’d do that on Thanksgiving, and they had a different set (plus the WOO) for Christmas, as well as Abbot and Costello’s March of the Wooden Solders (which gravitated to channel 11 over the years, and I’m not sure who airs it now). That was a good idea, actually, building an audience for the show.
A lot of people in anime fandom are anti-pirate, too. I’m talking about the organized fandom, of course. I think there will always be pirates, even without eye-patches and parrots,
I prefer to wait for the official versions because, frankly, pirating sucks. Not only for the reasons you’ve statesd but, quite often the pirated copy is substandard quality.
Granted, I have more fun listening to spoilers. They have not spoiled anything for me, in the long run, and some of them seem just so far off the mark… There was the “Snape Killed Dumbledore” spoiler that was all over the place. Even then, that did not reveal the plot, or what led to Snape apparently killing Dumbledore.
It’s more fun to read between the lies. ;3 The best way to read between the lines is to actually read the lines themselves. The best way to read between the lines, themselves, is to read a clean copy.
Going to have my coffee and, maybe, a bowl of oatmeal now. TTFN!
scorbet
February 24, 2012 @ 8:25 am
What makes it worse in this case is that there is actually no windowing taking place. The release date for both the paperback and the ebook is the same – March 6. What has happened is that amazon has decided for reasons of its own to start sending out the paper book 2 weeks early, and people are being abusive to the author because the ebook is only being released on the proper release date. Which is a logic I cannot even begin to understand.
Scott
February 24, 2012 @ 9:19 am
It’s actually a part of the outmoded “music” business model (the first one to show any real significant change and/or movement towards purely embracing digital. Digital music resurrected the idea of “The Single” again, after many years. From probably the 1970’s onwards if you liked a song on the radio, then you would trudge out to the music store and buy an entire album just to get the song you liked. This is part of the reason Music companies were so pissed at digital when it came round. It made artists be VERY aware at the quality of music they were constructing, and that no longer could they throw together a 12 song disc and just know that people HAD to buy the album and accept lackluster other songs, if they wanted the hit(s)…at $15-20 a pop no less! That’s finally changed with music and record companies and artists are being held responsible for quality once again.
In that same vein, the idea that to watch GAME OF THRONES up till now you had to subscribe to the entire channel of HBO feels like the record company-style equivalent of sticking their tongue out and saying “You gotta buy the channel, which comes with all this superfluous stuff you may not want if you want to see it.” You’re right that’s a BAD business decision, and looks like bullying on the part of HBO. Look at the BBC (already mentioned as an example), DOCTOR WHO, MERLIN, BEING HUMAN, SHERLOCK ect. are all available day and date of broadcast (or a reasonable amount of time after). It smacks of HBO not wanting to adapt their business model (the one that makes you subscribe to the channel) and embrace digital. AFAIK to date HBO is one of the only channels (pay/subscribe or otherwise) who don’t put their shows online via iTunes (or amazon or whatever) until the DVD or Blu Ray set is out in stores. Which to me defeats the entire purpose of the digital aspect. Up above that we get into the fact that even then HBO puts the stuff up digitally at the same price as if you buy the set…when the digital stuff has no physical production (discs, case, copies) at all.
Across the board books, movies, TV shows all need to get out of the dark ages and embrace digital and figure out a new business model that works within this era. Like the idea of publishers setting eBooks as more expensive than the physical books is a BLATANT kick in the face to their customers. They are saying “We don’t WANT you to buy eBooks, because that will force us to rethink the business model that has made us all this money for 200 years…waaa waaa, we don’t want to do that.” There is ZERO other reason to have a hard copy printed book be less money than a copyable digital eBook file. It’s bully tactics plain and simple.
I would never endorse pirating, and what happened with Seanan’s book and the response it got is utterly reprehensible. I also flat out LOATHE entitlement, as I personally have no issue waiting for books, movies, or TV to be released properly (as I just pre-ordered the GAME OF THRONES Blu Ray) but what should happen from all this stuff happening is that producers of the media(s) involved should be thinking “Geez, we need to change something here. This response is terrible. Let’s adapt this to work for all parties.” Sadly, like the music industry they will need to be dragged kicking and screaming because they simply don’t want to change, or they don’t want to wait for the turnover to warrant them profits that they are looking for. Digital media that is released at the same price (or more expensive) as physical media is CLEAR proof of that refusal.
Stephen A. Watkins
February 24, 2012 @ 12:40 pm
Let me just add, regarding the outmoded business model of serialized video/film entertainment content distrubution, that I understand the persepctive of those companies that follow this model.
In the old, pre-cable, rabbit-ears days of television, content was distributed free, and paid for almost entirely by advertising. With the rise of cable and other content-aggregation distribution systems, a new revenue stream came available: license fees. This is what cable and satelite operators pay to networks to carry their channels. Nowadays, upwards of half or more of a typical cable network’s revenue stream might come from license fees. For a premium channel like HBO, which I believe is not ad-supported, that revenue stream might be closer to 90 or 100% of revenues. The rest would come from stuff like DVD sales and possibly other licensing agreements like syndication.
The thing about those licensing fees? They’re paid on a per-subscriber basis. (I used to work for a cable company, years ago.) It doesn’t matter whether a given customer ever actually views a channel, the channel/network will get revenue for each of a cable operator’s customers as long as the cable operator carries the channel. That makes it very attractive to networks to want to maintain the current model… Because if they switch to a more a-la-carte style pricing, where only customers who actually view the content pay for it – such as through direct content purchases through itunes – that won’t come anywhere near to replacing the revenue lost if the cable/licensing regime falls. Not unless the contest is priced at a fairly significant premium – okay, not $1K-a-pop premiums, but we’d still be talking a lot more than what you can probably buy the season-DVD for.
So, like I said, I definitely grok the frustrated customer perspective on this… and I agree that companies need to discover new business models. But right now the various alternatives aren’t exactly attractive to the existing players. Good quality television programs aren’t cheap to produce…
Stephen A. Watkins
February 24, 2012 @ 12:47 pm
Also… I’m not sure how my current company’s online disclosure rules impact my participation in this discussion. I should probably bow out of any further comments, just in case. I do not work for HBO (and my figures on their revenues are pure conjecture, based on my understanding of the business in general), but I do work for a company under the Time/Warner umbrella – so of course I’m bound not to disclose proprietary data on the subject, and I have not disclosed any such properietary data that is not otherwise publicly available. Everything I’ve stated above in my two comments are purely my opinion.
Laura Resnick
February 24, 2012 @ 12:53 pm
The Seanan McGuire incident has really knocked me sideways. The ebook will be released on the official release date in two weeks, and meanwhile the mmpb print edition is unexpectedly available now… How is this cause even for slight irritation among readers, let alone abusive RAGE??? How is this even a MINOR INCONVENIENCE to people awaiting the ebook, let alone the rationale for vicious insults and threats of violence?
I’m not going along with “entitlement” as the expanation, because I don’t see how such a disastrously distorted sense of proportion can be anything other than seroius mental illness.
A person who discoveres that the print edition of a novel is avalable 2 weeks early but the e-edition is not, and who reacts to this information with verbal abuse, obscenities, threats of physical violence, hysterical accusations, etc…. is a person whose sense of appropriate proportional response to the ordinary, mundane daily stresses, frustrations, and disappointments of life is SO distorted, dysfunctional, and warped… that person should certainly NOT, for example: drive a car; use any sort of heavy equipment; use sharp tools or instruments; have access to fire; work with children; work with the elderly; work with anyone physically sick, weak, or disabled; drink alcohol; work with the public; be in a position of authority over anyone; etc., etc.
If ONE person wrote the sort of threats and comments about this matter which Ms. McGuire has described… “mentally ill” would certainly be the logical assumption to make about that person. And I don’t see that quantity (more than ONE person reacting this way to such a non-incident) is really cause to change that reaction.
So I’m going with “widespread mental illness” rather than entitlement.
Jim C. Hines
February 24, 2012 @ 1:36 pm
I’m very reluctant to go with mental illness as an explanation. In part because I think it does a disservice to genuine mental illness, most of which does not result in this kind of abusive behavior. But also because … well, I guess I don’t see this kind of behavior as being so out there as to require that explanation.
People will do very shitty things, especially if you get into a groupthink/groupmind kind of scenario. I don’t know what’s happened here, but if these attacks on Seanan originated in a single spot — say an online Kindle board where people fed into each other’s outrage and abuse — I could easily see these sort of attacks spinning out of such a situation.
Which doesn’t in any way excuse or justify the behavior. Nothing does, full stop.
serialbabbler
February 24, 2012 @ 2:34 pm
Yeah, it’s actually fairly common internet behavior. (That’s why nobody ever reads comments on news sites anymore, yes?) More of an unpleasant cultural phenomenon* than an indication of individual mental instability. Not that one can’t feed into the other, of course.
*Some have argued fairly convincingly that non-clinical narcissism has been on the rise since the 1970s. I haven’t seen anything that would make me inclined to disagree.
Elizabeth Anne Ensley
February 24, 2012 @ 2:39 pm
There are actually acceptable times to read the commentary. One is when you need a genuine laugh. Some of the commentary is so absurd, that you can only digest the implicit, though unintended, humor that way.
Kineko
February 24, 2012 @ 3:47 pm
Well… My two cent as a french fan of Game of Throne.
There is not even a date announced for Game of Throne in France. We don’t even know if it will come out on TV and if it’s going to be on public or private channel. Or if it’s going to came out on DVD or TV On Demand.
So what I did? I downloaded it. I plan to buy the DVD as soon as HBO sell them but the next option is waiting for a french channel to buy the adaptation right, butcher the show with french dubbing, put it on TV at indecent hour when you’re working the next day and one to two years latter, sell the DVD at indecent price.
So yeah I download Game of Throne season 1 and will do it again for the second, but if I knew for sure that the show will be on french TV, not too butchered, or soon to be released in DVD, I would have waited a bit. Even a few months. Some people are too much into instant gratification…
Elizabeth
February 24, 2012 @ 11:56 pm
It’s only peripherally related, but in my fantasy world I can buy a hardcover copy of your book (or another author’s book) and also pay a small surcharge to download it to my e-reader.
Adam
February 25, 2012 @ 1:18 am
The worst I’ve done pirating anything was downloading mp3’s of songs quite a few years ago. But even then, I preferred to but the actual CD’s when I had the money. The first reason was simple, I actually listened to the whole CD rather than just the one song that was released as a single. And the second reason is also simple, I like having a physical copy of what I paid for.
I couldn’t imagine pirating a book, especially if it’s for an author whose work I really enjoy. If there is an author I really enjoy, I will gladly pay for their book because I want to support them, I want them to write more books so that I can read more of them in the future. But I’m also a realist and I know that I can’t always afford to buy every book that comes out in HC, so for every book I try to think about how much I really want the book, and whether or not I’ll wait for PB before I buy it. For example, I’m a fan of Fantasy novels, when the last book of David Farland’s Runelords series comes out, I’ll want to read it, but I’ll most likely wait for the paperback version. When A Memory of Light comes out, I’ll have a reserve copy waiting for me at my local Barnes & Noble and will probably be there shortly after they open to buy the book.
Also, if I decide to wait for the PB version of the book, I can always go out and buy other books that already have PB editions. There are so many books out there, I’ll always find something to read.
Along with books, I own a lot of movies. I also purchase all of my movies, in part because I like having the physical copy like with CD’s, but also because I’m a nerd and I watch a lot of the special features on DVDs. I love seeing all of the ‘behind the scenes’ stuff about the movies, and I’ll even sit there and watch the director’s commentary.
There have always been ways to get things cheap if not free. There are plenty of used bookstores, and if you don’t want to buy the book used you can always go to a library and get it free. You can also borrow a book from a friend or a family member. I don’t have an exact count, but I’d guess that I probably have 50 books that I own that I’ve given to my mother to read after I was done with them.
And while the anonymity of the internet makes it easier for people to steal things (especially in the digital age we currently live in) I don’t really think it’s something that many authors or other creators should really be terribly worried about. If you put out a quality book/movie/video game/whatever, there will be people (like me) who will purchase it to support you. In many cases they’ll be willing to purchase multiple copies or versions of it. I’m pretty sure TOR said that they were going to release trade paperback editions of all of the Wheel of Time books with the eBook covers (which are all wonderful). I already own all of the books, and I will probably buy those editions as well. I’ve done this before, and the best example I can give is a video game. I have purchased at least 4 different copies of the game Final Fantasy 4 (originally released for the SNES, I have copies on PSX, GBA, NDS, and PSP).
Last comment about the anonymity of the internet. Grow up people, just because you can get away with calling someone a (insert insult here) is a very poor reason to do so. Quit acting like a spoiled 3 year old and try to behave like an adult.
Jim C. Hines
February 25, 2012 @ 11:05 am
I would love to see something like that, similar to movies now where you buy the BluRay and get a DVD and electronic copy with it.
Kathryn
February 25, 2012 @ 5:39 pm
Baen do something similar with some of their books. Certain hardcovers (usually Weber, Drake, Ringo, Bujold, IIRC) come with the “Baen CD” which gives you not just *that* book in a variety of formats, but the preceding ones *and* those of other series.
And you know what? There’s not a single pirated copy of those Baen books. They’re freely available on The Fifth Imperium, and I believe it’s been stated that every copy floating around the torrents originates from the Baen CD project.
🙂
Kathryn
February 25, 2012 @ 5:42 pm
It’s not uncommon for stores to ship early. Unless there’s an embargo or something similar in place (as there was with GRRM’s A Dance with Dragons), they’ll ship. Why? It’s space that could be used for other products, and other products = sales.
Just this year I’ve had two books published by Pyr release early (Thief’s Covenant & Shadow’s Master), for example.
Daniel D. Webb
February 27, 2012 @ 8:21 am
Kathryn, I’m not sure about your facts re: the release windows for hardcovers and paperbacks, but maybe you know something I don’t. I’ve been a bookseller for a few years, which lets me watch the industry from one vantage, but admittedly I don’t see what happens at the top.
In my experience a year’s turnaround is average for a paperback release after the original hardcover. The variation there is not random; as I tell customers in my store, they release the paperbacks when the hardcovers stop selling. Some come out in three months; some take substantially longer than the average year. The latter case is almost always due to runaway sales. “Breaking Dawn” and “Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows” were both out a long time before the paperback saw shelves. Suzanne Collins’s “Catching Fire” is pushing the record, having been out a few years already and not even a paperback release date in sight, and yes, the common theme here is that all of these were tremendous bestsellers.
Annoying, yes. Greedy, arguably, though I’m willing to concede the publishing industry is in enough trouble that they need to work their angles to stay afloat. But not irrational.
Daniel D. Webb
February 27, 2012 @ 8:23 am
That technology does exist and is in use; B&N has that function available on the Nook. Not for every book, though, and how they decide which ones should be lendable is anyone’s guess. The Nook is also compatible with public libraries which offer ebook programs, or at least with the libraries in my area. Implementation is not yet widespread, but we may see that within another year or two.